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The following posts have been reprinted in their entirety from posts e-mailed by readers of this website, except that headers, names and locations have been removed. These posts express the opinions and experiences of their authors, and this site publisher makes no representations about them in any way whatsoever. Re: Quixtar i appreciate your article on quixtar. (http://members.tripod.com/~nomorescams/quixtar.htm) you are right in every aspect of your article about the connections of quixtar with amway, but i thought you may like to know the rest of the story. the deboss and van andel families fronted the money for MICROSOFT to develop quixtar. how does quixtar benefit microsoft?--it doesn't, at least not yet. when the new 'quixtar isp' is released next year who do you think will run it?...microsoft network. amway anticipates close to 3mills representatives by this time next year that will be signed up for quixtar...this amount of customers added to msn would possibly put them over the edge in their effort to beat out aol. talk about a scam..people won't
know that microsoft will be running the isp...it will be aliased
as quixnet.com just for each user to access quixtar 4 times a month and have approx. 6 shoppers log in under thier respective IBO number, daily traffic would exceed 4 terabytes easily. microsoft is the only company out there (for the most part) that could support that kind of web presence and interfacing dial up isp. thought you would like to know. i hate scams. p.s. however, if you would like to benefit from the scam...watch for quixtar to go public in a few years and throw some money into the IPO. with microsoft's name stamped all over quixtar, the stocks will be sure to explode. |
Re: MLM Widow
Let me begin by thanking the creator of this site. I have needed some reassurance that I was not a dream wrecker and an unsupportive wife. I have lost my wonderful husband. He has been replaced by a self serving, greedy, mechanical responding, elusive, and totally different person. I am an extremely ethical person and have never felt comfortable with this "business". My husband has missed so many special family events and is in the process of alienating good friends and family. However the most heartbreaking part is he is missing many special moments with his two children ( 6 mos and 3 yr old) and mentally hurting a wife that loves him dearly. I continue to hope that he will be successful and achieve all of his dreams, however I do not believe that I will be able to share this with him, certainly not with a company that has hurt so many families. I am sitting here lonely again as he is off for another weekend and re confirming in my mind that nothing is worth all this heartache. Thank you and God Bless.
Re: Melaleuca
I 'm looking for any junk on Melalueca, have you got any? I sure like your site as this should serve well to deter people from getting caught up in a scam, Keep up the good work
Respectfully
Re: Amway Widower
At this moment my lovely , but gullible wife is 600 miles away at a "dream week-end" staying at a Hyatt Regency being sold the dream . After 2 years of sot & selling the dream....We are 2 months behind on the rent....phone will be disconnected next week.
Re: Winners Circle International
Dear Sirs;
I am looking for information on this company. I have requested a full refund from them with no response!!! The company guaranteed a full refund within 7 days if not fully satisfied.
Re: Former Amway Distributor from India
Dear sir,
I am a Amway distributor in Jaipur, India. And I loose lot of
time and money with it. Then fortunately I visit anti Amway sites
and stopped it.
Naw, I want to share this information with others by making them
aware what acutely is happening. People in India are not useto
with internet. So I am not getting how to spread this? You people
are older(senior), experienced and already helping people.do send
me if you have any printed matter.
Please guide me
waiting your reply....
Re: Kevin Trudeau and Amway, Part II
Well, Kevin, There You go again..Part 2
The Trudeau/Amway Partnership
In an interview with Brill's Content magazine (June 99' issue page 99) Kevin Trudeau says that he is "finalizing the details to partner with Amway to market their multi-level in South Africa and Australia." WHAT? Trudeau and Amway partners???? Could this be? One of the worlds most respected marketing companies partnering with one of the worlds most sought after, investigated, and twice apprehended and convicted felons???
THIS JUST CAN'T BE TRUE!
BUT, AMWAY????
This just could not be. Surely Kevin Trudeau, the country's most notorious liar is once again lying about a relationship with a most reputable company so as to boost his own stature.
Does Amway, the most successful and respected and largest multi-level company in the world really need or want Kevin Trudeau, one of the worlds least respected and least successful Mega-Criminals and Mega-Liars as a partner? Is there such a lack of good promoters and marketers among the 2 million plus distrubutors that Amway has that they must have Trudeau to help them expand their world organization?????
You don't believe it?
Neither could I.until I listened to a conference call between Kevin Trudeau and Amway "big time distributor" Don Storms (770 521-5383) where Trudeau describes his partnership with Blaine Athorne, Don Storms, Dexter Yeager and Jody Victor? To be the exclusive trainers for this new Athorne Quixstar Amway organization! Then I began to thinkcould this be true? We haven't heard any denials from Amway or anyone else.
I can only imagine what Rich Devoss must be thinking right now!
Re: MLM Scams
I find your site on MLM scams
really interesting... parallels many of the first- (and second-)
hand experiences
I've had with MLM over the years.
I have settled on a MLM (that likes to call itself "Network Marketing") that meets my needs and has been above-board with me in all respoects. But then, it's a publicly-traded company, and I liked what I read between the lines on its SEC reports to begin with.
I found your Amway/Quixtar page to be very much on-target and close to my knowledge of how the company runs. I signed up as a distributor and made it to Direct in 1969... and became disillusioned with the uneven enforcement of the "ethics" guidelines. Bailed.
My current MLM? States up front it's for *personal consumption* of product and *some* retailing (if desired).
Almost all my income is from the $10 or so (close to average) a month I make from personal consumption of product in my downline. And since that's an up front disclosure, I'm pretty comfortable with that.
BTW, last year, my affiliated company axed a 10,000+ line of distributors for screwing around with recruitment--false claims, etc. Big dip in immediate profits, but this year has seen morale boosted by last years' axe.
Interesting, eh?
MLM *can* be done ethically, but as you pointed out about Amway/Quixtar, it needs to run a fairly open book. SEC disclosures for a publicly held company are a start... (Although we all know how those are cooked to look in too many cases...)
Good work on the site. Keep
it up. Keep *all* our feet to the fire!
Re: WorldWide Dream Builders
Hi I am currently discussing an option with my husband that has to do with Amway, but this is the catch;the organization calls themselves "world Wide Dream Builder" and puts down the amway training business.they say that their org. is much better and willwork if you work it. I am having a problem seperating this wwbd from typical amway type selling. can you please help me out in this issue. are you familiar with the wwbd group. They still are selling amway doingpromotional things also. thanks
Quixtar/Amway
Dear Sir,
I also was approached by someone wanting me to sign up with Quixtar.
After finding out that it was a subsidiary of AMWAY, I knew that
there was no future in it. The only people that ever profit form
MLM's are the people that start them.
There are so many people out there that are starving for a way to make money that it is easy to get taken to the cleaners. One way that people should look at it is, if you have to pay someone to work for them you are getting taken. If you go in for a job interview and the person that is hiring you asks you to pay for your first two weeks worth of checks, are you going to work for that person? Of course not. So why do people feel that they have to pay someone to work for them out of there homes.
The term BUYER BEWARE comes to mind every time I see advertisements like this. My husband and I joined AMWAY in 1992 and when our sponsor droped out of sight we were just out of the money that we had spent to join. When I called AMWAY to find out about Quixtar they wanted me to sign up again, and pay the money again. Sorry but I have learn't alot in the last 7 years, and you don't pay anyone to work for them.
Sincerly
Re: Quixtar
Hey there:
Just want to drop a quick line to say THANK YOU for the info on your web site! I have been approached by a number of people in this Quixtar thingee and I am so glad for some information (unbiased and TRUTHful) regarding these big plans. I have been involved in a number of MLM's (Excel, NSA, American Longevity, New Vision) and just can't find one that stays true to itself. If you have any "background" information on any of these, I would appreciate it. I am looking for an honest company that provides good products and service. I know you don't recommend companies so I won't ask for one. I would ask that if you have any information on any of these I've mentioned, could you share it with me.
THANK YOU in advance!!!
Re: A Survivor
I received a magazine in the
mail; "Business 2.0" which had a very favorable article
about Amway & Quixtar. I was in Amway once, and am a survivor.
I appreciate your website. I did a little surfing and found a
few sites you might be interested in.
www.classifiedclub.com/mall/quixtar9199.html
www.rws-publishing.com
www.cplintl.com
Perhaps these folks haven't received the notice form parent Amway
about not having any sites, or not signing up distributors until
9/1/99??? You might be interestd in their "spin" on
the "opportunity".
Regards,
A survivor.
Re: AMO afterthought
Hi! I've enjoyed reading your pages from your readers regarding their experiences with AMO's and other MLM. I can relate to their plights and will be glad to share them shortly.
Since you yourself was "with the business" for 10 years and worked for a Diamond five years, can you tell me (based on your knowledge and experience) if the business-to-business aspects is sound (i.e. Amagift marketing to large business and corporations)? Also, what do you have about FlashNet? I'm looking into this and would like some input on this.
Thanks alot and keep up the good work. Remember, the truth will set you free!
Re: Quixtar
very well written, but very inaccurate site. It's good that most won't find you. The rest of the world believes Quixtar will be huge, and they will be correct. Yes there is money in tools, big deal, I disclose that in my plan
Did it ever occur to you that
only 1% are direct distributors because it takes about 100 people
in your organization to be a direct?
Re: Amway/Quixtar
I don't know what to say. You people must not have anything better to 0do than research people's past history when they do something wrong. My husband and I have been with the Amway corp. for over two years now and have never had a problem with anybody's conduct in or out of a business setting. Just because you either ran into the wrong people(yes, they are out there whether or not you are in a multi-level or not) or decided not to do the work isn't everybodyelse's fault. Get off your high horse and figure out that not everybody associated with Amway or Quixtar is a fraud.
Sincerely,
A contented distributor
Re: Trudeau
With all due respect, can you judge everything based on Kevin Trudeau? I still don't see how he is tied in with Jody Victor and Dexter Yager.
Re: Amway/Quixtar
I think that the information on this page is very informative. I have been researching the MLM business in general and paying particular attention to the Amway Corporation. I don't know where all of the information you have is from, but it seems to me that a lot of it is as inaccurate as the business plans that are professed to be misleading. I have consulted numerous sources and I have one question. If the Amway plan is so misleading, how come it always seems to slip through the cracks while others like IHI are found so easily. A friend of mine is an Amway emerald, and I have seen his books. Yes he spends a lot of money travelling, but he doesn't work anywhere else and neither does his wife. Oh by the way, I also saw the professed super profitable "tool" business he has. Dave actually loses money on his tickets and other tools. The only time he makes any money is when he speaks at a seminar, and lets face it, people like Anthony Robbins and the like make a lot of money. I don't hear anyone screaming about their profits from seminars. That's a part of any type of people business. This page is obviously well funded, but it appears to me that it is nothing more than a lot of whining and moaning about decisions made in peoples lives that they have nobody to blame for but themselves. It is this readers opinion that pro-mlm and anti-mlm sites are just a crutch and the REAL truth probably lies somewhere in between.......
Just a note: I found your site
through the quixnet.net server with the filtering option active.
I guess that blows away the theory of Amway stopping all the "bad
guy" sites,........food for thought?! [Actually, a very
pleasant surprise!]
Re: Omegatrend
I read the post about Omegatrend
and would like to add some info. I agree with what was there but
it didn't address the company's progress. I mean the experience
presented was from 92-93. What Omegatrend has done is move on
from it's early beginnings when it was much more like a Amway
look-a-like. These days Omegatrend has programs that have always
been focused on helping people at the lowest levels achieve more
in income and rewards, unlike Amway which does the opposite. The
Company is also very family orientated. In the last 5 years Omegatrend
has moved forward in ways that Amway could only dream of. I have
been with the Company for 7 years and have seen the good and a
few bad choices the company has made. I shall let you know I am
not a high achiever in Omegatrend but have had reasonable success.
I have seen the way Omegatrend has grown and with their ethics
and goals for the future wouldn't dream of leaving them. Anyway
I believe that it is an insult to Omegatrend to compare them with
Amway just because their past came from there.
One must judge individual Companies on their merits. Omegatrend
will not open a new country to 'prop' up sales like Amway has.
It is committed to getting people into the countries to help people
achieve. Sometimes this means waiting a bit longer but it gives
a stable support for those new people. Well I could go into the
actual programs they have but they are not the issue. Basically
Omegatrend has tried to take the good points of the industry and
avoid the bad points. So far they are doing a good job of it.
Hope this sheds a bit of light on the subject.
Re: Same as Amway?
Dear Sir:
Are there other mlm or network market type of company s out there that are going down the same path as Amway ? If So who are they and what are they doing wrong ? I would like to here about others that are doing the public wrong by there deception.
Regards,
Re: Quixtar
I recently bought into this Quixtar thing, but soon realized it was Amway that I had bought into and not Quixtar at all. Quixtar doesn't exist. The whole idea of "signing up ahead of time to get people under me" is ridiculous since NO ONE can sign up for Quixtar until September 1st, 1999. When I approached my "UP LINE" (what a joke!) to tell her I wanted nothing more to do with it, since I had read your website and suggested she do the same...she didn't believe me. Three days later I was approached by her "UP LINE" who said,
"I heard you read a HATE SITE and now you don't want anything to do with Amway. That's a propganda site put up by Proctor & Gamble. They tried to sue Amway and they lost, so they put up that HATE SITE. It's really too bad, too, cuz it stops people from achieving their dreams".
I didn't respond.
I don't want to be approached by anymore "UP LINE's".
I don't have those kind of dreams.
I NEVER want those kind of dreams.
Good Health, Peace of Mind, & Happiness to you all!!!
Thanks for the info!
[FWIW, I have very strong objections to this site being referred to as a "hate site." If you take the time to read it, you'll find that the most hateful things on the site are letters from Amway distributors ranting and raving about the information I have posted. I also take strong exception to being accused of running a "propaganda site put up by Procter & Gamble." These accusations are slanderous or libelous -- depending on whether they are spoken or written -- and definitely false. ]
Re: Omegatrend
I've read numerous articles on your site and am unable to comment upon the validity or rationale that make up those comments. Many actually seem a bit far-fetched and even a little irrational. The only comment i can make is to an item by David Gerrard relating to Omegatrend and Mr Gerrard seems a little uniformed to say the least and certainly a little bitter. Presumably he is a FAILURE as a 'former distributor' (there are no distrbutors at Omegatrend - it is not a term I have heard in the seven years I have had a tenuous connection with the organisation).
At least he is not totally uncomplimentary. But he really should get his story right. He states that Omegatrend is a pyramid of 'effort and dreams' - so what! Without dreams and effort mankind would still be in caves and is the people who make dreams and effort amount to something, become realities, that advance the cause and development of mankind.
T E Lawrence observed that some men dream in the depths of the night with their eyes closed only to wake in the morning to find it was but cruel vanity. Other men dream in the light of day with their eyes open and these are the men who change the course of history.
Why not dream with your eyes open, Mr Gerrard? You might become a better person, perhaps more successful, who knows. Maybe you'll be extraordinary instead of just ordinary!
Re: Tripod
I sense someone is feeling threatened by another mall on the Internet. Huh could It be tripod?
[Huh????]
Re: Quixtar
I just went to a Quixtar meeting
last night. For the record, since you didn't have this info. The
fee to get in is $99. The jury is still out in my court. Yesterday
was the first I heard of Quixtar and I am still researching both
sides of it. I am leary about it since I found out its relationship
with Amway. But I am trying to keep an open mind as I dig deeper.
Thank you.
Re: Amway
Hello,
It looks like you have put a lot of effort into your web-site and it truly does look wonderful.
I do disagree with your evaluation of the Amway & Quixtar businesses. I started a traditional business involving the installation and maintenance of business telephone systems, voicemail systems, and data network wiring.
A few years ago I started my
Amway business and partially "plugged in" to their system.
While I didn't give a lot of time to my amway business, I have
to admit the stuff I learned from the tapes halped me learn success
principles that I put to work in my phone company that radically
changed my income there. After a while I saw the business side
of building an amway business, and have started to put some time
in there too.
And am started to see an increase in income there too.
The bottom line I think ( but
I'm no scholar ) Amway is just a business, not really very different
from any other. I pay my employees anywhere from 12-16 dollars
an hour and charge my customers $50-75.
That's just business. My upline makes money of of me. If it weren't
them it would be Sam walton's family or someone else, that's just
a fact of life.
Someone will always make money off of me and off of you too.
PLEASE DON'T THINK I AM TELLING
YOU THAT YOU ARE WRONG.
If someone represented the business to you wrongly or if your
ideals are different than mine, that's ok.
This is America and ther is
room for us both. God Bless you, and I do hope you find something
you can enjoy and be succesful with.
I only took the time to write you this to let you know we are
not all am-droids, or jerks.
God Bless you & your family,
How are they making money on training ? What products or services are they not selling ? Whats your information on the two companies you
who is Equinox and Excel ?
to whom it may concern:
i wanted to write to you and
let you know how appreciative i am of this web site. a few weeks
ago a guy in a restaurant approached my fiancee and i about "how
to make money on the internet". we were skeptical, but
we thought we would hear him out. with his no pressure sales approach,
he waited two weeks to contact us again. after an at home visit
filled with vague claims i thought i would see what i could find
out about this
QUIXTAR program. using yahoo's search engine, i got over 600 hits
for quixtar, all of which linked to the QUIXTAR site, except of
course this site. we had no idea of the magnitude to which these
people were total
scum. so after writing him a rather firm e-mail, he came to our
house and took his "tools" with him, which was last
night. the level to which these people scam is unbelievable. are
there any consumer advocacy groups out there that can help expose
these low-lifes for who they really are and put an end to this
blatant fraud? when i decided to check up on this topic, i never
imagined that i would find out this kind of information. thank
you in the most sincere fashion for this web site. without it,
i would have lost at least some money before i realized that these
poeple were scamming me. if you are compiling information regarding
these people, the distributor was ** and i live in the northern
suburbs of ***. please feel free to contact me if you need volunteers
for anything, this is something that i think everyone should know
about and i am willing to help if there is something that i can
do. my name and addresss is as follows:
***
once again thank you for this web site.
sincerely,
Re: Amway and Quixtar
So you saw your Diamond, whom you do not name, tax returns for his Amway business? You blame your inability to build a group on the business? You're sure you weren't or aren't unrelatable to people?
You're not backing anything you say up, you're just telling a story, and there are three sides to every story.
I suppose you'll tell me the people who make it to Diamond do not earn it.
[Actually, according to some court pleadings, that's absolutely true.]
I'm sorry you had a bad experience and are so bitter, but it is not Amway's fault.
Warm Regards
Re: Ziff Davis article
Thought that you may be interested
in this page on ZDNET's on-line magazine. Came across your site
the other day in my research, and thought that you may not have
seen it. So much of this is what you say is here too.
http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2288269,00.html
Any way, enjoy the read. I am currently fighting against what
my wife's "friends" are trying to do to her.
Re: Quixtar/Amway
My parents are Amway distributors and are very excited about the new Quixtar opportunity. I thought I would find a little info on the subject myself and in doing so came upon your site. I've spent the last couple of hours reading through the e-mail posted on your site, and all I can say is, wow! I'm not sure how to react to the majority of the people that have aired a story or complaint here. My parents are educated people that held responsible jobs and raised three successful, well adjusted sons. They have recently retired and look to Amway, or now Quixtar, for something to pursue in retirement. They buy a tape a week and attend most of the seminars and conventions. They really like them. They have always complained a little about the politics that are promulgated some times at the big conventions, but they do the same with every Sunday lunch hour political commentary show. They have been running their business on a part-time basis for a few years now, and my brothers and I have yet to detect any brainwashing or cult-like behavior. I have to laugh a bit as I write such things. They haven't done the sales presentation as often as suggested, but they have been able to make enough money for the business to pay for itself. They have simply done as much as possible on a fairly consistent basis. Now that they are both retired, they have cranked up the effort and it shows. My brothers and I purchase merchandise from them on a regular basis. I just tell my Mom what I want, and she gets it for me. I don't really know if it cost more or less than Wal-Mart. And I don't care. I only spend about $40-50 or so a month, so who gives a damn whether or not you save $5 bucks. I run a business, and it keeps me pretty busy, so its nice not to have to spend my spare time in line at a discount store. And my parents make a little profit off my volume. Someone is going to, so I'm happy it's them. She now says that I'll be able to purchase these same items through their own Quixtar site. I already buy stuff on-line, so I'm looking forward to the new deal. Granted, my experience with Amway has been second-hand, and the same is true for my brothers. Between the three of us there is a CPA, an attorney and a MBA, but more important than that, there is a close knit, open family. If our parents were brainwashed and constantly spoke and acted in the manner described by the majority of those who have responded to your site, we would have noticed by now. I guarantee that my sisters-in-law would have noticed, and like it or not, all would know about it. And all this, "I went broke, and my marriage was ruined" stuff. I've never heard such bitching and complaining in my life! My parents' business expenses run about $3,500 annually. Between retail profit, bonuses (from product volume only) and self-employment tax benefits, their business breaks even. I do their taxes, so I know. And they haven't been at it that long. Certainly not on a full-effort basis. They understood up front that it takes a tremendous effort to make the big bucks, and they saw the same sales plan that the rest of you did. I think it's pretty sad to have to admit that you have been duped, brainwashed and controlled by an Amway distributor, or any salesperson for that matter. Use your head. Investigate. Ask questions. Say no or maybe if your not sure. I shutter to think of what an Avon lady could do to you? How low in life do you have to go before this happens? Good god, you people make a much bigger deal of this than it really is. It is just buying stuff, and finding other people to buy stuff. It is a business, so there are expenses involved. My parents advise that no one tries to hide that at the sales presentations. Who would think that there wouldn't be expenses in running a business anyway? My parents are both 64 years old and have never sold anything in their lives until Amway. Please. If you're a 30 year old business person and you can't match them, you sure as hell won't make it in the corporate world. They're not brainwashed. They're still married. They have all of the same friends. They have made many new friends. They go to the same church. My Dad plays golf with the same guys that he has for the past 20 years (they really gave him hell at first). They don't talk about Amway any more than the rest of us talk about our work. Probably not as much. They like the other distributors in their line. They like the meetings and conventions. And all that said, they have disagreements between themselves and their co-distributors. From time to time they disagree or get board with the speakers at a convention. They don't look at their big distributors as gods. Nor would they ever blindly be led or coersed into buying something or doing something that they were against. They realize that there is profit in the tapes and conventions. Who doesn't? They don't always make a profit at the end of the month. They take some ribbing from my uncles and some of their friends for being in Amway. So what. They've had ups and downs for the past 45 years in the work world and personally. Who hasn't? Most of you folks need to learn a lesson in life from people like my parents. I don't care if it is with Amway, your marriage or whatever you do. And I don't really care if Amway is a scam or not. There is good and bad, right and wrong with everything. But something tells me that the whining and moaning heard hear is the same whining and moaning that you hear every day at work, at church and just about anywhere you go. And just like you complain and make excuses to why Amway didn't work for you, I'm sure that you will act the same when the next thing doesn't work the way you want. Good luck, you're going to need it.
This page updated Aug-04-99
