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The following posts have been reprinted in their entirety from posts e-mailed by readers of this website, except that headers, names and locations have been removed. These posts express the opinions and experiences of their authors, and this site publisher makes no representations about them in any way whatsoever. Re: Equinox I am also ashamed to admit that I too fell into the ugly we called Equinox. After being out of that scam and reading Rob Stylers book I saw how lucky I was not to make it to "the top" of that company. The book was a great read because I had been through a lot of the same things, I guess you could say that it was all a good reminder of what a scam Equinox really is. I suggest it to any unlucky soul that got tricked into Equinox. If you are still in Equinox and reading this might I suggest running as fast as you can.

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Re: Quixtar

I've been researching Amway for over one year (and it lead to an unhealthy fixation to the alt.religion.scientology newsgroup in the process, thanks to following a link and a strange fascination with cult-like behavior. All hail Xenu and DeVos!) due to a co-worker who got suckered into believing she'd retire at 35. She gave me the countdown9199 address, and immediately I knew what she was trying to do.

I just visited your updated Quixtar page, which lists several vendors. My question is, is Amway just an affiliate to these sites? I know Amazon and CDNow have affiliate programs in place, but there's not a lot money to be made. But anyone can sign up to be an affiliate as long as they have a website.

Also, I really enjoy your site. The Ambot letters are a hoot! They rag on you for time spent building a worthwhile site, yet they're the ones responding in self-righteous indignation. The time spent berating you could be well spent in a basic English/grammar class.

I read with interest you comments, etc.-----esp. re: Amway/Quixtar. If you know anything about it at all, you KNOW there is great $ to be made in this business for anyone who actually works at it. The $ spent is nothing unless you aren't willing to do the work. I've been in the business for several years. I DO get a check every month but it's not the amount I would like, however, I only sporadically work at it so know it's my own fault. I wouldn't give up the business for anything because it's so positive. You apparently had a bad experience. I'm sorry for that. You also apparently didn't take any of the positive with you if it was Amway you were in. What do you know about Jewelway? Also, what do you know about Excel? Are they still in business----the MLM business, I mean. One other comment. How do you think Amway has stayed in business for 40 years if it's so bad? It was proven to be a valid business years ago by the US government who measures every MLM against it. How is it that there are so many millionaires? OK so this is more than 1 comment & a couple questions. What happened to you that was so bad?

I want to know why when someone sends a negative message about Amway you print it without any comments, and when someone sends a positive message about Amway you fill it with your opinion do you not think that the reader can decide for himself what the person is trying to say? Please run all emails without comment unless your trying to brainwash people into thinking like you! I was also wondering were you ever in Amway and why did you not have sucess? at what level in the business did you quit or did you ever hit any level ?

I just wanted to thank you for your website. I was close to becoming involved with Quixtar. Went to a mtg last night, and going to another (insiders training) tonight. I have had doubts, but they make it seem so easy, and all of the people there were obviosly upper -middle, I figured they're intelligent folks.

But I never fell for the speaker's line of bull..and noted when he contradicted himself. I'll be happy to pass it on for others to listen for should they be intersted.

I am in sales as my "real job" and look at this as an opportunity to learn about business in general, and what motivates people to buy. It's like a free sales training course, listening to this guy (Gus Fernandez..ever heard of him? I'm going to do a search on him in a minute) and watching these people fall for what he's saying. It's like they see only dollar $ign$ and don't really listen to what he's saying.

And it does sound good, and he's got an answer for everything, but when you really think about it, and if you visit the website which I have attempted to do numerous times only to my frustration, it is indeed a scam. But a pretty elaborate one, you have to admit.

I just wanted to make a few comments regarding information I read on your web site. The first thing is that I've signed up as a Quixtar IBO, and feel much better after reading your lies and truths, and realizing that I was not misinformed about anything. The second issue involves the stability of the website, which is understandably experiencing some difficulties. If you would like an excellent example of internet sites experiencing start up difficulties or growing pains, I recommend you take a look at Ultima Online, an online role playing game which started almost 2 years ago. [Seems to me there's a big difference between an online GAME and an online BUSINESS.] The game was in "beta" testing for quite a while, handling around 2,000 players at a time, and crashing constantly. When the game went public, several thousand people signed on, and of course there were still a multitude of problems. Despite this, the game has grown tremendously, and has become the most profitable online venture that a gaming company could imagine. The game and their technical staff are constantly refining the site, and gaining in their own experience. The point is that many new web based businesses will experience sporadic troubles, and growing pains, however with time and patience, and advances with technology, these things get fixed. I'll let you know how things go for me! Thanks,

Can you provide any informationon an MLM called "Finl"? I was trying to get some on the Internet, but 'surfed' on to your website. I was once almost convinced to join Amway, but my wife was skeptical. Deo Gratias.

I am writing to inquire about Quixtar. I came across this venture through someone advertising e-commerce opportunities under the guise of debiz.com.

I went to a regional meeting last night. I am a skeptic and that's why I came across your site.

How did you get this info and what is your motive? I ask because I'd like to tell the IBO who referred me that this is a scam. I'm sure he'll say that the person behind mlmsurvivor site is bitter or is out for revenge or something.

Thanks

I have a sister that is caught up in these MLM schemes and It is really putting a strain on our relationship. We are at opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to our opinions about the legitimacy and viability of the mlm concept. She is a true blue believer, despite the fact that none of the several has worked out. I the past several years she has been a "distributor" for a number of mlm companies and she still cannot show me one compensation check. It's amazing to me that someone that has spent the better part of seven to ten years working at something that claims to be the answer to finding financial freedom has not earned her one dime in compensation. Not to mention all the money she's paid to be a part of the organizations and the other "business" expenses incurred which is in my opinion sobering in itself. All this considered, she is now on to another "revolutionary" company called Skybiz 2000 which "markets web pages". In my opinion, the mlm concept is ridiculous and logically has no chance of succeeding for anyone other that the operators of the schemes.

I have been trying to research Skybiz 2000 and an affiliated company called Direct Approach, Inc. and have not found anything other than their own web sites and company initiated propaganda. Anything you know about this company would be greatly appreciated.

Keep up the good work. Your efforts to shed some light on this "cancer" (my term for mlm and network marketing) is most noble.

Thanks,

I cannot believe your LIES about the Quixtar launch!! Quixtar was open for business on 9.1.99, no matter what you believe. I visisted the site a least a dozen times myself!! There is something called "bandwith" that you need to understand. Quixtar received 20 million "hits" on 9.1.99, which would use more bandwith than most e-commerce sites today could handle. That is why it appeared to be "closed." About the errors--I'm sure that even you (who must be perfect according to your accusations) had errors when you designed your site! How can you expect a site that is hundreds of times larger than yours to be even more perfect? Errors happen (I even got one trying to load this page--it said it couldn't find your server!), and we just have to accept them in a technological world, especially one that outdates itself even before it it figure out its newest technology. And talking about Windows NT servers--you obviously don't know much about e-commerce, because if you did you would know how much easier it is to do anything on the net with NT than any other operating system. Yes, UNIX is a slight bit more stable, but it's interface is not nearly as workable as NT (in my opinion). Plus, more and more systems are being switched over to NT these days, so why not try to stay compatible with everyone else?

You are no better than those who call liars and cheats...at least they are positive about life. You do nothing but look for the negative. That shows a poor character in a person.

I recently began a temporary position with a major * position in **. About 2 weeks after starting, an employee who was training me asked me to go to a Quixtar meeting to get "the oppurtunity of a lifetime" and "a chance to pay off all my bills in no time". I obviously avoided this entire situation and did not attend. After another invitation that I ignored, he began making comments like "You know that Burger King is always hiring" and "Maybe you'll get a real job soon". I think he is making these comments because I refuse to go to these meetings. His most recent attempt was a video explaining all the wonderful things that are happening on the internet and how I could be one of the first to get involved. I really, really do not want to have anything to do with this, however, I feel like I am being pressured by the fact that I really want a permanent job here. How can I tell him I am not interested without offending him and risking an actual oppurtunity of a lifetime (i.e. this job)? I desperately need some help.

Multilevel companies have began to catch my interest I see a lot of negative on your site about Amway, what I would like to know is if you are familiar with any other companies that have been as successful as the Amway corp. If so please let me know. I see more and more acceptance of this type of marketing and although I am sure it is not an easy type of business to build I have never been afraid of hard work and commitment to something to make it work. Also I have visited the Quixtar site and to me it looked pretty impressive like you, I hope they get the bugs worked out soon it should be a nice way to shop as they add more partners.

It is amazing to me that people have the time to slam a legitimate business. One example of a questionable person in a business does not label the entire business. For someone like myself, who wants financial independence and is willing to work for it through Quixtar and Amway, it is a fantastic business. I am already seeing positive results. The company has $1,000,000.00 an hour in revenue. It is unfortunate that some people feel they have to slam a business model if they do not agree with it. Please do not place myself or my other colleagues in Quixtar and Amway in the category of criminals. Maybe if you all had something legitimate to spend your time on you wouldn't need to pundit a proven business model. Good day.

Part II

Would you please briefly explain the reason behind your hatred of Amway? How is it that one could dislike a business? Have they done something to you? Or are you connected with a competitor that Amway is removing market share from? Thank you for your response.

What a joke You would think that quixtar or amyway would have at least have there product site working. a mad ibo

Hubby and I have been in for (ta-da!) 9 years. By the way, today is 9-16-99. I was disoriented by the lack of dates on these e-mails I read. Didn't know how old they were. Anyway, I always felt like something was wrong--especially since we're Catholic, and my sponsor encouraged me to go down for an altar-call one Sunday morning at a function. I was very near the front and saw the self- satisfied look on the Diamond's face when all these people came down to profess their love for Jesus. I felt an aura of great evil looking into his eyes, and was repulsed by it. I have since told my sponsor, who really believes she is a good woman, that I hate Mr. B.... I know that's a strong word. I really don't hate him, but I feel what's going on in the organization is shady. So, I will tell more of my story later. Sometimes my ISP disconnects, and I hate to type all this and then lose it. To make it short for now, after reading stuff from your site, and the e-mail links, especially, I told my husband I refuse to go to anymore functions, listen to tapes, and especially, read books. Some of the books are evil. Napoleon Hill in particular. More on him later. Needess to say, my hubby, who is an honest, genuinely wonderful man, was angry with me. He had such hopes of this being the answer to our prayers for a better lifestyle. Now, I know it's bothering him, and I have made some consiliatory noises, just to let him think I'll go along with building quixtar until we can make some money, then get the heck out. So, everytime I e-mail, I'll start off by saying the e-mail is from m. baboo, and I'll give you a run- down on our involvement. (I'll also give the date--please encourage others to do so.)

Hi. A friend sent me an email about an MLM called Linkopp, where you can get people to put banners on their webpages, and you somehow make money from that. Have you heard of these types before? Are they a scam like the rest?

I was recently approached about joining into this new Internet investment that was going to be big, really big. For three weeks I anticipated joining Quixtar. Finally when I decided to do. I ask the IBO that is trying to persuade me into joining to give me his IBO number and pin. Well, up until that point I was sold. But once I went in and started looking around at the products, I realized there were not things I normally buy; there were only two stores I could really say I knew about previously; and they buys were not that hot. To me if quixtar is going to grow, 1. it needs to get on a real person level have things that families shop for, not so much as top quality, things that people on a budget cannot really afford, 2. Get companies involved that people shop in like Walmart , Target, Sears, and JCpenneys to name a few. I can't see asking people to shop, when I can't really say I am going to shop there. 3. I think that people need to have a way of paying, everyone does not have a credit card. And by only taking credit cards are a check debit (master/visa card) I feel they are setting limits. I also thinks that ATM debit cards should be accepted.

I think that quixtar could be good, but from what I have seen in the last three days on the internet, I am convinced that I could not solicit people to join. So far from what I have seen I think I have been mislead. I was told this was not AMWAY, but from what I am seeing that's the most.

I was also told that I would be getting $70.00 back to shop with. But really what I will be getting an AMWAY packet. If I wanted to try AMWAY, It would need to be my choice and not being forced on me.

Thanks for letting me express myself.

Thanks

A misguided IBO wrote:

>I appreciate you taking the time to respond to my concern. After reading your e-mail we realize that we are fortunate because our upline and the >INA network do not operate this way at all and we have received support and encouragement from our double diamonds in our upline. We are very >excited about our new business and are proceeding full steam ahead. [quoted from post38]

To the best of my knowledge, INA does not have any Double Diamonds.

About four years ago I almost got sucked into joining Equinox International but it was with a smaller child company called Ecology Marketing group headed by a man by the name of Scott Arett. In fact Arett had me so excited I had been preregistered to attend one of Bill Gouldd's basic building blocks. Thankfully my good sense took over and I got out of going. When I told Arett that that I changed my mind he wasn't so nice anymore and he got real nasty and insulting. They seem to move around from one leases store to another. Rescently I was curious about them so I logged onto their website and clicked that I was interested in in being a sales rep. A few weeks later the same Scott Arett called me back and when I realized it was him I got such a creepy feeling that I begged off and he immidiately wanted to know WHY I no know was interested in Equinox International. As far as I know they still operate in ** .

you people are a bunch of whiners. do you have a vehicle for me in which i can become financially free? how many millionaires have you created? it takes some work, no doubt. those looking to get rich quick will surely be disappointed. do you get negative on all motivational tapes? tapes are just a means of distributing information and keeping people pumped up. it's not brainwashing, it's brain cleansing. you need to stop playing those negative 'tapes' inside your head and change your attitude. read any book or listen to ANY tape on success or motivation or self-improvement. it's all basically the same stuff. focus, purpose, excitement, attitude. i could call college a scam too. gee, i signed up for classes and then they made me buy books for $50+ each. then they buy them back at the end of the semester for $3. then i had to pay them $12,000 a year and they 'mentally raped' me with all their liberal, left-wing bullshit. whine cry piss moan. go collect your welfare check and the rest of us will have to take care of you.

MLM?huh, get with the times -mlms are a concept from the past any attempt to make quixtar and mlms a comparible business is as foolish as your web site. If you knew any thing other then negitive thinking you might use your creativity to better use. Of course getting involved with a progressive com. like amway-oops I mentioned the A word! I've encountered many people that have negitive feelings about this form of business and as I have mentioned FEELINGS are a bad way of making right choices. only the fool hearted make decsions based on their feelings . that must explain why so many americans today are flat broke and in debt. when you get with the times you might see quixtar as many of us IBO's do. and who knows you might champion the idea. PS-I'm not going to hold my breath!!! and keep in mind Henry Ford had the same kind of people in his time saying the same stuff . I'm guessing you own a car . what a shame- you only have one life to live and you spend it on such foolishness. get a life and save your self!!

maybe you can justify your own resentment in not becoming an IBO, but the fact remains that you go and cry yourself to sleep. Saying that quixtar is such a dud only proves the point that you were not man enough to make it work. Are you the type of person that puts everything important to rest before you actually try it. Believe me when I tell you that I was not the amway type, I hated the name (everthing it stood for) repelled me, pyramid, scam, MLM, all of that. But I actually see what is meant by all of there hoopla. Do your work and you will not have to do it again. Build your business once, do it right, and all the worries are gone. If you are serious about your future cantact me at ** if all you want to do is comlpain about the hard times you had just continue to write your bullshit story on your website. The choice is really up to you.

Thank you for your response. I have not been "active" for 2 years, have not attended one meeting or function, nor have been purchasing tapes or moving any products, but have still kept an interest in the possibilities of building a business. I have kept my Amvox voice mail and listen to messages, and keep a close friendship with my personal sponsors whose business hasn't really grown very much. (For their own personal reasons.)

I have questions concerning the possibility of things being done differently than in the past (experiences like yours and the many others that I have heard of.)

In any self employment gig all that you can do is learn from your mistakes and the mistakes of others and correct them.

Rather than allowing someone else's mistakes to cause one to quit something that MAY BE good and positive, might it be better to change the way that things are done?

For Instance. If the "Motivation Business" was not kept a secret, and was promoted for exactly what it is from the start, with no deception involved, and if MY prospective downline was told the truth about the fact that one must build a very very large group while investing alot of time, effort, energy and money into the products AND system before substantial profits were achieved (from either), do you feel that a decision for myself to build a Quixtar (product / motivational tool and function) business would be harmful in any way towards the potential people / persons that I would be looking to sponser?

If so, how and why?

I would very much appreciate your time, effort, and energy to elaborate.

Sincerely,

The way she got my personal information: I've posted my resume on a few internet sites because I'm looking for a real job. When she called, I thought this to set up an appointment for an interview. I wasted 3 hours yesterday because of this. I don't have a car at the moment so I had to take the bus (I wasted $1.00 getting there and back home). This is the ONLY money that I will be spending on this scheme.

Thank you for allowing me to express what happened to me. If you'd like to respond, my email address is: **.

FYI: Equinox just 'opened' a branch in **.

Sincerely,

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