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The following posts have been reprinted in their entirety from posts e-mailed by readers of this website, except that headers, names and locations have been removed. These posts express the opinions and experiences of their authors, and this site publisher makes no representations about them in any way whatsoever. Re: Nutrition for Life (NFLI) My daughter referred me to your web site because she saw a reference to Nutrition For Life, Inc. (NFLI). I have spent 2 1/2 hours searching without finding it. Will you please tell me how to find it? Thanks,
I am surprised they are allowing you to get away with maintaining this web site, because as far as I have been able to determine is you are contributing to "dirtying" their name because of the content of the web site. I believe that based on what I have seen so far is that you are deliberately trying to slander the name of Amway by having the web site accessible to the general public. [It's called the U.S. Constitution, and the Bill of Rights. . .] |
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Re: Quixtar
I have read your story, sounds great. The benefits of being involved and reading positive material, and associating with people who succeed in life - not just the business, is worth so much regardless of what happens to your business. Its your business after all, not Amway's. You would know that all the groups are different, and your experience is by no means the same as every group.
If you really want to view a cult, then look around you. Who says that you have to work 9-5 for 40 years to live on less than you can now...
I am one of the most skeptical of all, and took me at least 4 years of seeing the business for what it really is, rather than what I thought it was, to accept it.
I can understand your views about the new ecommerce model, but you have got to be kidding. the fact that the quixtar site, had an overflow feature that sent traffic to IBM, and brought down there site with all the traffic. IBM sold one of the biggest as400's to quixtar. There is no ecommerce site that could have handled all the traffic generated there in first week. 1 million IBO's, only about 180,000 are actually building the business, most are just members, and some just collect the monthly magazine. I'm actually wondering how many of the million actually registered as an IBO. A vast number will still be registered as agents for Amway
Anyhow quixtar isn't awmay on the web, and amway doesn't own it. Find out at least some of the facts first.
If big corps believe this is going to be big, the biggest thing out there, then I'll listen to their views.
Re: Quixtar
Yes, I'm a Quixtar IBO. I've been in Amway for many years, and I'm excited about Quixtar.
Though there have been several disappointments, such as things not being done yet, I can relate since I'm also involved in working on a web site for my employer.
I want to point out some incorrect information in your article:
Sales are not impressive. In the September 21 article, VP Ken McDonald is quoted as saying that "there were $1 million in sales during the site's first two weeks in operation." Since Amway is now claiming in the neighborhood of one million North American distributors, or IBOs, that means that each one ordered ONE WHOLE DOLLAR's worth of product in the first two weeks. A far cry from the blow-your-socks-off e-mail I was getting from IBOs, such as the one that claimed Quixtar would generate $100 million in sales the first day. First, I didn't find an artilce on September 21 with Ken McDonald. [Reporter LISA SINGHANIA wrote the piece, titled "Selling-giant Amway makes leap online ." This article was published in a number of different newspapers between 9/21/99 and 9/26/99.] However, I did find an article on 9/22/99, that says:
Sales are not impressive. In the September 21 article, VP Ken McDonald is quoted as saying that "there were $1 million in sales during the site's first two weeks in operation." Since Amway is now claiming in the neighborhood of one million North American distributors, or IBOs, that means that each one ordered ONE WHOLE DOLLAR's worth of product in the first two weeks. A far cry from the blow-your-socks-off e-mail I was getting from IBOs, such as the one that claimed Quixtar would generate $100 million in sales the first day.[Obviously this writer needs to learn how to cut and paste a little better. I never did find out what he was trying to quote. . .]
The $1,000,000 sales DAY is by far better than your quote of "$1 million in sales during the site's first two weeks in operation." So, where do you get this quote? It wasn't in any of the McDonald letters that I saw! Are you that much against Amway/Quixtar that you have to misinform the general population with disinformation? [see above] You're credibility shrunk on this article that you wrote.
Like I said, I've been involved with Amway for many years as a distributor. I've seen nothing that shrinks their credibility, even with the Quixtar being behind schedule. Believe me, people that read your material and think like you aren't probably the best prospects, anyway. I'm not looking for people who find problems with everything. I'm looking for lookers, people with dreams, people that are open-minded and warm-hearted. People with ICE-hearts like yours will probably always stay broke, or if they aren't, they stomped on people to get ahead.
Another difference that I have always believed in - those that succeeded in Amway only got their by helping many other people make money, whether it was a six- or seven-figure income, or a few hundred dollars more a month. The other world out there - employers - only get ahead by keeping wages down and forcing people to put their jobs ahead of their families or their health. I've looked at other MLMs, and found that most have limited products, income, and lack of upline support. Yes, there really IS a need for the conventions we have!
My main purpose for this email reply was to straighten out the misinformation that you have posted. [What misinformation? Just because you don't read the papers doesn't mean I made up the McDonald quote.] As I know you wouldn't be able to change my opinion about Amway/Quixtar, I also doubt I would influence your opinion. Feeling though, that as long as your mission seems to be to sway or influence potential Quixtar clients, members and IBO's from getting into the business, then I think that it is only fair that you post correct information.
Part II
I do appreciate your reply. Thank you for taking the time to write back. Your views may be different than mine, but I still respect you as part of the human race.
We all have all of the answers fro everything. At least we think so. If you accept my truce, then what I would like to know from your perspective, what IS a good deal for a career? What is your belief in what the best system in the world is? And before you answer "whatever you believe you are good at doing, and want to do for the rest of your life" - I already know that.... I want what you would believe would be guidance. I want to know what YOU think would be a great career, a great life style. That would be really cool, just to understand from a point of view, somewhere on the another side of a socio-political spectrum, what would be a type of position in life (somewhere above being a janitor and below being the Pope).... a realistic viewpoint. I'm listening, . Lay it on me, what YOUR viewpoint is. In other words, educate me. And I do believe, I have not much doubt, you are probably much more financially successful than I.
Re: ACN
I am wondering if you have any information about a company called American Communications Network. I have been approached by a family member who claims that this company is involved in transferring electric customers to new suppliers after their local companies have been de-regulated. I would appreciate any information you may have.
Thank you,
Re: Amway
Hey:
I don't know you, and so you too don't know me. Here am I just to share some words about the effect that your site produced me just a few minutes ago.
I'm from Chile, Southamerica, and well... I'm an IBO since July/24 of this year. So, excuse my english because is not so good. I speak spanish.
Well, I discover your page just recently and I get very, but very, worried about the things you've said on it.!
Is not the moment to tell you my personal story with Quixtar and Amway, and how I get to this "business opportunity", I only want to share to you that recently I have spend some money using my International MasterCard; And now I'm getting almost in shock if all the things you put on your page are true.
Just want to ask you for information, if you could. Because I'm very insecure by now, after this "another point of view" discovery for me. In sometimes I had suspected that there's maybe something wrong, just a little feeling, but many times in my life I have taked risks and never close my mind to "new" possibilities.
I'm an Entrepreneur, sociologyst, partner of a Human Resources Consulting Firm here, and an Internet lover. I'm just 27 years old, and my especial experiences in life are not much (up & down), even better maybe are a few. I think I always have been somekind of an "estable" or "normal" person (psychologystly talking), from a good and honorable family, son of a Medical Doctor, all brothers professional people, etc.
But, I have never feel like this before. So insecure. Thinking that maybe my "friends" lie to me??!!!... Yes, I'm really worried. But I'm concientness that is my problem, so I'm going to investigate more to get the truly information.
Anyway, I'm very openminded to find the truth. And thanks to you for that new "point of view" that you gave me when a read your site.
Sincerely,
Re: Quixtar
Gentlemen,
I would like to thank you for offering your forum on Quixtar.
On Monday, 10/18/99, I responded to a classified ad in the local paper.
It ran as follows:
I'm expanding and diversifying my business and am in need of two or three people to work part-time form their homes earning $2000-$3000 per month. For interview and appointment, call XXX-XXX-XXXX.
I called and chatted with the man offering the "job". He had no computer, but coached me to the site via telephone. The site didn't function properly (because I have cookies disabled in my browser), but he offered a variation of the IBM, Microsoft, $250,000,000 invested, thousands of partner stores, yada yada yada. It didn't feel right, but I have just closed down one business and am searching for other opportunities.
I set an appointment for Wednesday, 10/20/99 and promised myself I'd run a few searches on the company today.
I did so, found your web site, and the rest, as they say, is history. I canceled the appointment and resolved once again to always follow my gut reaction.
Thanks again, and keep up the good work.
Re: Quixtar
Hello,
I am responding to the Quixtar article on your web site. I feel that you are right on some points and wrong on others. I just do not think that it is right for you to be so judgmental of an E-commerce site only one month after it's start up. Why don't you give it a little more time like 3-6 months or even a year. I don't know of any E-commerce site that did not start out with glitches and bugs to work out. That's just the nature of computers and software. Amazon still has yet to turn a profit! That site has been around for what...5 years?
While I do value your opinion I do have to say that it is after all only your opinion.
Thank you,
You are way out in left field without a clue of what you had your hands on.
NEVER GIVE UP NEVER GIVE UP NEVER GIVE UPNEVER GIVE UP NEVER GIVE
UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! QUIXTAR.COM RULES AND IT WILLSET ME FREE WITH FINANCIAL FREEDOM, SECURITY, AND EARLY RETIREMENT BECAUSE IT ALL DEPENDS ON HOW BAD DO YOU WANT A PIECE OF PIE!! IT TAKES A GO GETTER TYPE PERSON TO
SUCCEED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Re: Top Secret
Thank you for your site. Do you have any info on an mlm called Top Secret inc?
Its similar to quickstar. You get $ 100 if you get people to sign up with a discount shopping network.
www.topsecretsinc.com
It costs $ 238 to join.
Thanks for any info you may have.
Re: Amway/Quixtar
This is a great site that more *prospects* should find before they're taken for a ride!
I can't believe all of these people who can't or won't acknowledge the connection between Amway and Quixtar - Amway IS Quixtar - Quixtar IS Amway - there is no separation.
We left the business before Quixtar was being actively promoted and was being used as the *cookie* - Amway's satellite and internet ordering was the thing of the future, etc. etc. etc. At that point the *new wave* was (I don't recall the actual name of it) everyone was signed up to order a month's worth of everything, it was automatically put on your credit card and automatically sent every month. You couldn't do it by cash or check - you had to put it on your credit card. You had to submit another form to stop it. Supposedly some distributor in North Dakota made a killing doing this (of course there's no stores for miles up there!).
We found it quite amusing at the time - Dexter Yeager had always promoted not using credit - delayed gratification, he called it - and now all of a sudden they were not just promoting, or encouraging, but demanding that you put all this stuff on your credit card. We balked at this immediately and waved goodbye!
Amway is debt-free, Amway makes $$$ profit every year, etc. etc. etc. - and why wouldn't they. They didn't need to enforce the 10 customer rule, they made plenty of bucks off their own distributors! We paid for tapes, we paid for books, we paid for rallies, we paid for *functions* and we paid for every single little order form and catalog - we paid for shipping - we paid handling fees - and surcharges and whatever else they dreamed up ---- and just as soon as you bought all that literature for whatever the current promotion was, they changed the promotion - that literature was no longer good, and it was necessary to buy the literature for the NEW promotion!
And so much for those family values that our Crown (Kenny Stewart) and our Diamond (Jack Pawlak) preached at us at those *functions*. That Crown (previously married and divorced, who deserted two children by his former marriage until he became Diamond) and his glamorous diamond studded wife are now divorced - had to split the *business* - because they were both fooling around with the spouse of - none other than - other Diamonds! - What a crock!
Our directs (they've been at this level for at least 15 years) are still living in a hole in the wall that makes our modular home look like a mansion - but they're driving a Cadillac (bought on credit - delayed gratification - huh?).
Well, thanks for you site, and thanks for the opportunity to vent regarding this sham of a business. My advice to people to see this *plan* is to usher these people out the door as fast as possible and keep a good tight hold on your billfold. Find a good stable job and stick with it - you'll come out far ahead in the long run!
Part II
Good to hear back from you. I don't really know the details of the Stewart's divorce, but did hear that they were both *involved* with some other Diamond (or higher) spouses - I can't recall the names - some of the ones in the SE. I understood that their business was split in half - which makes sense because a good part of it was Donna's family and their groups. There wasn't too much said about the whole thing - they just kind of dissolved out of the picture.
The picture in the profiles including the boys was when everyone realized that there had been a previous family for Kenny. He had been a homebuilder in Springfield, MO, and either the business was already down the tubes, or it went down the tubes when he became involved in Amway. He built this really huge house (everyone thought it was a factory) outside of Springfield - the funny part is that you can ask most of the people around Springfield about him and they've never heard of him!
We were in the Pawlak line - however, there was no one higher than a Pearl between us and him - just a very long line of *directs*.
The final straw for us came at a function in Dallas. On the way, our car broke down in Oklahoma. Fortunately, our *directs* were a few hours behind us and picked us up - we had the car towed to the nearest town and went on to the function (we were assured that the upline would help us get back home). Once at the function, we were totally ignored by our upline and offered no assistance in getting home. As we choose not to use credit cards, it was impossible for us to rent a car - and ended up hitching a ride back with a *crossline* couple (a no-no, of course). The cincher for us was the fact that Jack had his limosine in Dallas, but was flying somewhere else from there so another direct was driving it back to Missouri (where we live) empty. Although they were all aware of our dilema - no offer was ever made by any of our upline to help.
When I complained about the fact that we were totally ignored at the function by our upline, I was informed that because we weren't at any pin level, were were basically nobody and that that *attention* had to be earned by success in the business.
What I see as the *upper crust* of Amway are a lot of previously rejected and unsuccessful people who could only make a *name* for themselves by taking advantage of other people in this system. They're absolutely nobody anywhere else except in *the business* so they lord it over those below them to make them feel better about themselves. Sad, isn't it that there's an entire corporation that feeds their insecurities.
Kenny owned a big house at the Lake of the Ozarks, which he in turn sold to Jack. Big deal, you know, if you were a certain level by x date you got to go there - big whoop! You could ride on the cabin cruiser and on the jet skis and the whole ball of wax. According to them they practially owned the lake! Funny, now I work with a lady who goes to the lake every weekend in the summer, owns a condo there and sails on the lake - the Amway people are the laughing stock of the lake - a bunch of lowlife hicks with too much money - they try to look influential but fail desperately. Many of their sailing group could buy and sell both Kenny and Jack a couple of times over!
Well, thanks again for the outlet - and keep up the good work warning people about this hoax!
Hello I found your site when I was looking for another site. You seem to be an expert on MLM's from what you have to say and pass along. I read your story, but who are you? Did I just not get your name or is it not published on your site or with your story? Regards
Re: Nikken
In the spring of 1997, my father, a preacher for 30-plus years, began selling magnets. In June of 1998 he gave up his comfortable full-time position for a 1/4 appointment which would give him no salary, but free housing--he planned to make his money through Nikken. As of October 1999, he is 18K in credit card debt, still with no income. He continues to buy product, tapes, magazines and attends conventions and meetings of all kinds. He hawks magnets, but mostly "the business" everywhere he goes--restaurants, at church after baptizing my cousin etc. He's into it up to his neck, but he's filled to the gills with "positive thinking" and "envisioning." There's no criticizing the products or the company.
I've scanned the internet looking for information on Nikken, but I've found almost nothing but there vague propaganda. The problem is not the magnets, but the mlm structure and the way they create false hope in trusting people like my dad. Is there anything I can do other than watch him reach bottom? I'd really appreciate any suggestions you might have.
Thank you very much,
Part II
Thanks so much for responding. I'll seek out the materials you've suggested. Now I don't feel quite as helpless...
Re: Equinox
Hello and congrats on getting the info out there.
I don't even know where it all began- I think I happened to meet someone who was oh, so successful with this great Environmental company. He showed us this "truly inspirational" video with a famous 70s rock star promoting the healthy living and environmental products that Equinox was selling. Ha. As a near-graduation college senior with no real idea where I was headed, I fell right into the idea of working for myself. Before I knew it, I and a bunch of my friends were signing up for credit cards that we had no business maxing out. Today, almost 5 years later, I still cringe each month when I pay the credit card companies for a bunch of overpriced equinox-friendly product which I threw away almost 5 years ago.
I am truly horrified that I ever fell into such a scam. Today when I tell my family or boyfriend why I have so much credit card debt- I simply say "oh just some silly college-days fun that got out of hand". It is pitiful.
but alas, I've gotten out and am a much better person for it. I only hope that others will really "see it"---see that getting out before spending any money is the best thing. When will we get some control over these scams.
If it is worthwhile, feel free to post this or contact me for more info. I'd love to keep in touch with you and others.
This page updated Nov-05-99
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