The following posts have been reprinted in their entirety from posts e-mailed by readers of this website, except that headers, names and locations have been removed. These posts express the opinions and experiences of their authors, and this site publisher makes no representations about them in any way whatsoever.

Re: MLM

THE MOUSE: I have always had an entrepreneurial spirit, so naturally I have always been a magnet for "Venture Opportunist" ( Amway and etc. type reps.). But I had heard many horror stories like the ones on your website, which I believe kept me skeptical. Although I attended many meeting at hotels and the homes of some very wealthy people, I never signed up.

THE BAIT: The idea of residual income, however, intrigued me. This left my mind open to MLM.

THE TRAP: I finally commit to joining a company but not 'The Big A.' I invested my time, energy and money - going to meetings, showing the opportunity, buying and retailing products all to receive little in return, very little. A year later some of my upline started to leave and became upset with the way reps were being treated. Some quit networking altogether but one guy joined a upstart company that was marketing Webtv's before they were sold in stores. He show me some of his checks and his upline's checks and with my intrigue of residual income and my stage in life (my wife was pregnant with our 1st child)I forked over the $700 to join and receive my Webtv and I committed to purchase $100 of product mostly phone cards per month.

I made thousands of dollars in six months but if you subtracted my spending (advertising, phone bill, monthly req. and etc.) my net was approx. $1,300. Within the next six months the company raised its application fee to nearly $900, decreased the pay plan to cut our checks by 60%, and Webtv's in the store became less expense than ours.

FROM MOUSE TO TRAPPER: But by now I became the student of a number of big time MLMer's - people making over $10k per month in the industry. I decided to do what they do. This was a big mistake because I was not as well capitalized. After approx. 20 months of joining and marketing several different programs, I was lucky that it only took me one year to get back on my feet.

THE REALIZATION: Needless to say I got out of MLM. The only benefits from the whole ordeal was the experience and some friendships that was developed.

FROM BAIT TO FOOD FOR THOUGHT: After two years I realized that there are only three ways to make money in America:

1.) Trading time for dollars: I got a good high paying job with excellent benefits.

2.)Putting your money to work for you: I invested in some mutual funds, stock options and a retirement saving program with my job.

3.)Compounding your time: Hiring employees, franchising, becoming a small business owner, or the least expensive - MLM.

After my networking experience I stayed away from #3 and only focused on #1 and #2. Now my wife and I are the proud parents of a toddler and twins and have a beautiful home.

Several months ago my wife and I reflected on the 'WHYs'and 'What ifs'. Why we entered into MLM? So that one of us could at least spend more than 15 hours Monday thru Friday with our daughter. Why it did not work? Well you fill in the blank ______. What if there is something out there that would help and it worked for average people?

A NUTRITIOUS MEAL: So the search began. The hype, hoax, pie in the sky and coded messages (all traps)were abundant, but many months later within the deep waters emerged a company with an interesting motto "Our Respentatives Come First". I thought, "What a ridiculous quote." I watched the video with the intent to pick apart their scheme and mind control tactics mainly because they offer a $5,000 reward if you can find a hole, tricks or better way for them to pay their reps. I watched that video five times in a row. Then my wife watched it. To both of our amazement we could not find a fault. Their pay plan is patented. Even the founders and CEO are paid as reps. only. They have not and will not receive one red cent of corporate money. There are not any clubs (Diamonds, Executives and etc.). The top paying position is achieved by sponsoring 2 people and having 5 customers. I guess the August 1999 issue of Money Maker's Month says it best "A breath of fresh air now blows through the network marketing industry and many representatives are leaving companies that promise much and deliver little to join this company's revolution." Please don't get me wrong it is still work.

Conclusion: Although I believe this is the Wal-Mart of MLM and all of my downline are making money with no monthly requirement to pay, no volume requirement to make and the most value tool is a video that costs as little as $1.50, MY POINT IS NOT TO RECRUIT YOU BUT ENCOURAGE YOU TO COMPOUND YOUR TIME THROUGH MLM, BUT BE VERY PICKY ABOUT THE OPPORTUNITY YOU CHOOSE AS PICKY AS YOU WOULD BE ABOUT CHOOSING A DAYCARE FOR YOUR CHILDREN. AND REALIZE THAT YOU HAVE IN MOST STATES LEGALLY 30 DAYS TO TRY IT OUT FOR FREE. IF YOU ARE PASSIONATE ABOUT YOUR "WHY" THEN DON'T GIVE UP YOUR "WHY". THE KEY IS TO REALIZE THAT YOUR 'WHY' IS YOUR DESTNATION AND THE OPPORTUNITY IS YOUR VEHICLE. IF YOUR VEHICLE IS NOT GETTING YOU TO YOUR DESTINATION THEN FIND A DIFFERENT MEANS OF TRANSPORTATION. JUST DON'T DECIDE THAT YOU'LL NEVER GET THERE.

Amazing. I have never visited a website with so many horror stories! I am an Amway Distributor, well actually, Quixtar now. I have been involed with Amway for 3 years, have made money and since Quixtar have made even more money. I have seen people who have had regular jobs build a successful business to the point hey retire.

I am sympathetic to those who have stories to tell of disasters being a distributor. My feeling honestly is that being a distributor is owning a business. Most businesses fail within the first 5 years. This is not something amway tells you, the Small Business Administration does. Not everyone will be successful in Quixtar. Why? Who knows, several reasons.

My opinion about business has remained the same for years. Just because my business fails, does not mean i regret trying. Just because the shoe store fails, does not mean the shoes were bad, or my supplier was bad. I had a troubled time.

If anyone has tapes, and by the sounds of it you have thousands, and you would like to recoup some of your losses, please reach me. I will not want every tape you possess, but there will be tapes that I will like. I plan to push ahead. Will I be successful? To what level? I don't know, but if I stop, I will never know!

P.S. Learn the difference from being a victim and being victimized. Move on with your life. Not to sound unsympathetic, because it does really bother me to see so many horror stories. Life is to short, move on and may your negative experience with MLM not keep you from your next adventure. Be it MLM, working for yourself, or being an employee of another company.

God Bless

WHY DONT YOU MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS...AND LET QUIXTAR DO IT OWN...GO DO SOMETHING ELSE WORTHWHILE INSTEAD OF WRITING ALL SHIT ABOUT QUIXTAR...

SHOWS THAT YOU PEOPLE ARE OF VERY LOW MORALE AND SELF ESTEEM...

Dear Sir: I have logged onto the Internet tonight to learn more of the company 'Equinox.' It seems to me that, from the negative stories you have, that all of you have lost your dreams and for some reason would like to bar others from reaching theirs. If, in fact, Equinox was not the solution to your hopes then I hope you find it somewhere else.

Sincerely Yours,

If this is not the please to relate our MLM experiences, please accept my "I'm sorry".

The Wall Street Journal, Fortune Magazine, many International newspapers, and renowned columnist Harvey Mackay have carried articles about our MLM success. We have a complete line of all natural nutritional herbal, hair, and skin care products. As top money earners we have proven our ability to provide upline support. References given. This is a subsidiary of a 3 & 1/2 billion dollar, 125 year old international company beginning expansion in many countries. We plan to open Venezuela, Hong Kong, Singapore, and Taiwan this year other countries soon. MLM junkies need not apply. Serious business builders only.

For proof and documentation e-mail *.

HI my name is * and I was reading your web sit and I found it very interesting, but I didn't understand alot of it I was in 8 MLMs I never made a dime because it was just to hard for the average person. I was down to the point were I promised my self I would never do another one of those THING. But then a good friend of mie introduced me into a network marketing company. I had to check it out since I got her into 5 MLMs were she only lost money. when I got to the presentation I saw merchades Bmws jaguars etc. people with rolexs all the thing people wish they only had . I thought they put a little to much effort into this scam. Then as the presantation started I saw it was diffrent from every thing else I have ever done it was built so that the average person could do it. Me being an open minded person d ecided to give it a try. and I did, I never looked back. the company is called Market Amerca a network marketing company. I have had the pleasure of watching all of my friends and family make it big somthing that they could only dream in MLM. What I am writing to you is to tell you are wrong about the network marketing industry. I am making 4,200.00 a week residual working 8 hours per week this is the American dream for my friends and family.

I Have seen a Device called the "Chi" machine. An intelligent/practical friend owns one of these devices, which sell for about $500!! I have listened to "the tape", which sounds completely bogus to me,HOWEVER-the machine has helped my friend and some people she knows. My question is this-is it possible to track down the research , if any, done on this machine? I don't remember the companie's name. Thankyou,

hi, i am very glad i ran into your site by chance , i was contacted by a person on icq, he worked me real good sold me on the idea of amway /quixstar, so i met him and i thought this was a good deal, so i joined and became an ibo, little did i know i had to go to meetings twice a week buy tapes and books ,and go to all major functions, if i didnt he would shut me off and not pass along any info, just tease me by saying , oh thats right you didnt go , being my upline and sponsor he would't tell me what went on and that made me feel like a dog begging for a bone , i quit my job to do this and i havent made a dime just spent a lot of time and money , this is a real pipe dream , i wish i never did this and i dont know why the goverment lets this go on , i am sure it has hurt a lot of honest people , thank you

I just want to send a quick note to say thank you for your web page and the information you share. My husband and I recently signed up with Quixtar as IBO's and after only one week and less than $500. (thank goodness!) we are going inactive. Thanks to your webpage and the information we read concerning Anway, we feel thankful that we learned our lesson for such a small price. We are forwarding your web page address to most of our family members - who are also in the "business" and we are hopeful that they will see the light as well. THANKS AGAIN!!!

Sincerely,

CAN WE SUE ......ID LIKE TO KILL THEM ALL NEXT TIME I FIND THEM FOR KILLING MY FAMILLY.........}:-(....DEATHH TO LAS VEGAS.....

I would like to know if you've heard anything about Rexall showcase

I have a dear friend who has recently gotten involved in a multilevel marketing scheme called Maxxis 2000. She has put a great deal of time and money into this, and has been mad too-good-to-be-true promises of stock options, income and early retirement which has set off danger signals to me, but to which she appears to be immune. I want to help her but I need to be informed about this specific organization or I am certain that I won't be heard.

My question to you is this, have you ever heard of Maxxis 2000 and if so, what have you heard? Where could I go to find some expert information on this? The internet has only produced the gushing members sites of the Quixar type, so I don't really know where else to turn. Anything you have to tell me would be appreciated.

Yeah I got scammed

I was working as a teaching assistant in a Canadian school interpreting for a Deaf student. Being hearing impaired myself maybe I should have taken pride in the fact that I was helping someone out. I wasn't making a ton of money, but I had my own little apartment and some food in the cupboards. I had been stupid with credit cards in my past (who isn't?) and was pretty ripe for picking, I guess.

My two good friends became Amway distributors almost 4 years ago? Maybe three. I hardly even talk to them anymore. They are busy enough with their "organization" I guess, and maybe they have been able to pay off some of their outstanding debts. I tried working as a downline under them for almost two years. I later owed money more than ever on some of those bills that still had not been paid because I was "investing in my future with knowledge" from their "tools".

Ive been out of it now for almost two years. In Amway terminology they would probably say I lack "vision" or "stick-to-it-iveness" or whatever. I gave all my tapes and books back to my upline. I talk to them now and again, and I still consider them my friends. If they ever need me, and it doesn't involve doing something for Amway I will be there. That is the decision I have made for myself.

I want to tell my friends (they're married maybe I shoulda mentioned that earlier) that when Amway is gone or has soured for them, I will still be here. To me, that means that I have "vision" or "principles". I still havent told that directly yet. I want to. Im supposed to call them to share some holiday cheer. I haven't yet. I miss them. I live far away from them now, having recently been married myself.

However I will always feel stupid for having been suckered into that thing they call Amway. Whatever the hell it is.

Best of luck spreading the real word

Hi there,

I have a MLM experience to share with you, for the purpose of warning other people who may be seduced into the Mary Kay scam. Here's the deal with them. Yes they do sell makeup, and it is decent quality though very overpriced. That's how they stay legal. But you can absolutely not make any money selling this makeup because: for one thing, they require you to stock the makeup ahead of time in your own home, before you sell to customers, and you have to pay for it up front. (as opposed to taking their orders and then sending away for the products. You have to deliver the makeup immediately! No waiting for orders to come in!) Consider all the products, all the shades of foundation--they encourage you to buy $3000 of it as a starting order! So now you desperately try to find people to buy this stuff. Good luck. Of those who do agree to come to your makeup show, most of them will stand you up, or you arrive at their house at the appointed time and they don't answer the door, or they go through the entire show and then buy nothing when they see how outrageously high the prices are. And it really is hard to sell anything because Mary Kay won't let you just sell the individual basic skin care items that customers want--you have to sell the skin care products as a package, all together, and three years ago when I was doing it, that cost $65.00! This really hacks the customers off. So you have all this makeup on your hands. Then, every few months, they change the formula or the colors or something, so that you have to buy the new stuff all over again from scratch and what are you going to do with the old makeup? Sell it at cost probably. Zero profit. Plus consider all the money you spend on cheesy pink mirrors and applicators and samples, all that crap. And get this, they tell you if you are a woman that you should never be seen outside your house wearing pants, only dresses. And you should never ever leave the house without your makeup and hair done. Ridiculous! So then the only way to make money is to "recruit" people to sell makeup. That way you make commissions based off of their sales and their own recruiting. This recruiting is not easy! But even if you do manage to do this, most of those people are going to drop out soon. And the commission money you made signing them up will be CHARGED BACK TO YOU when they quit!!! And those uniforms you get when you reach a certain recruitment level? You pay big bucks for them! And for everything else! All these motivational conferences and everything. You pay it all. You pay extra for every little thing. When you call the company to order your supplies they charge your credit card extra for the privilege of making the call! You drive miles and miles putting wear and tear on your personal car. Good luck getting, and keeping, their "free" car! But they try to convince you that you will get all your money back as a tax write off. Yeah right. They also try to sell you all these books and tapes, which basically are dreck and have no actual business content, no accounting lessons to manage your business or anything of real value. They say they give you all the training you need to be successful. It is not business training. It is stupid brainless hype. They used to make us dance the Macarena at weekly meetings! How humiliating! Look here ladies. They tell you about all this great stuff you supposedly get for free. Nothing is free. Ever. If something sounds too good to be true then it is. If you hear their sickly pink sales pitch, RUN!!! And don't look back!

When you add this to your site, please don't use my real name or my email address because Mary Kay has lots of corporate lawyers and I don't want them coming after me. I have no money anyway, even less because of them.

Thank you,

Hi, I'm looking for information on Mary Kay Cosmetics. I have heard that there is information out there about them, in regard to them being a cult-like group. However, though I have done many searches on the internet, I haven't been able to find anything on them. If you have any information that could help me, I would appreciate it greatly. I was hoping that with your excellent information on Amway, you might have some contact with someone, or an email address, or something. Thank you for your time.

Sincerely,

H E L P........ I need some instructions on how to register as an add on where do I forward the $19.00. I can not log on to the AMWAY - ABN site for some unknown reason I can not get through the system.......HELP........ I can be E-mailed at *

Many of the ibo's have not ordered from the site yet so you comparing the number of hits to the number of ibo's is not relevant.

Check your info before you post it

I like your website.Been in the biz 4 years and always amazed at stuff I hear the diamonds say... none of that jive sponsors anyone. What I found works is selling products to people consistently and working to find customers first. NOBODY wants to be in the business until they see you make money. Most of my efforts revolve around building positive relationships and this takes tremendous patience. I see how easily people can get caught up in "The Dream" and all the Euphoria associated with it, however in my experience profit occurs as a result of work and not the result of some tape or a weekend meeting. I avoid the system as much as possible strongly encourage you to check out Jeff Probandts' Amway,an insiders perspective and Fugue's Notes. Be well. Your experiences shed harsh light on a troublesome part of the business. I welcome you to Life. Turns out,at least for me that my Amway business while growing slower than a prospect might get excited about, does grow. I do it honestly without manipulation or avarice and that just flies in the face of the system. I believe my system will one day triumph in the MLM marketplace because my whole life is about principles guiding my success not success guiding my principles. If you felt like the biz took advantage of you then that happened because you chose that outcome. I don't care what my upline thinks about me,I care what I think about me, and to share my life responsibly with anyone demands sheer honesty. I wish you all success in all that you do. There is so much more to life than Amway. "Happy Amway Guy"

They have virtually destroyed our lives. My husband got recruited "part time" about 7 years ago. Attending meetings at least twice a week and not really making any money. Through their form of "brainwashing"- meetings, meetings, meetings, he was convinced that he would make his fortune if he went into it full time and quit his job! He wouldn't listen to anybody who made sense...it WAS going to work! Each time he took money out of our retirement fund to help us make it through the month he still insisted it WAS going to work! Well, it hasn't worked! He was working 60-70 hrs a week, still going to meetings and doing very little business. He has hit rock bottom with severe depression but still has that little bit of hope that it will work.NEVER! He has been letting me in on some of the propaganda that goes on in these meetings: God's hand is in this business; Don't listen to your family they will try to take the dream away from you-when you start making money they will become believers; we need to deprogram you from the business world-they want you to think you have to work for somebody else; I talk to God directly; Don't get on my wrong side because I'm vindictive and I pray that people die! These are just a few. His "upline" even called to wish us a Merry Christmas but when his call was returned it was really just a pressure call to see if he was with us in 2000 or not...but no pressure! He has even yelled at me on the phone..wonder if i'm one of those people he prays to die! Please if you have any sense don't be conned into a MLM!

I agree with you on many of your points, however, you specifically mention a number of network marketing companies that you take issue with. And you've done your homework - that's refreshing.

Now, with the plethora of new mlm companies being introduced to the market place are there any out there that are "tellng the truth" about their opportunity?

Please understand that I am not looking for a recommendation. I am already involved with a network marketing company but I decided against using their "techniques." I have been a salesman off and on for most of my life and I understand that this is a sales business. It ceases to be "sharing" when you run out of people you know. It is my opinion that if the network marketing folks would own up to this one point and the fact that most people will not make it to the top, a lot less grief would be suffered. I endeavor to get my prospects to understand that this is a business. If you make friends fine, have fun fine, but in the final analysis you're in sales - and you should be selling it that way. I believe you ought to have fun with it but remember that you must be profitable or you won't be around.

And your point about profitability is also a good one - one that I learned the hard way, when I first started a business putting in real estate signs a couple years ago. The billing looked great but when you deduct mileage expense, time and effort you spend, then you wind up losing money. It caused me to re-evaluate the business and now I'm turning a profit.

You've done a good job with your web site - refreshing to read someone's account supported by more than anger about a situation that didn't work out - excellent use of facts (SA4400).

It would be interesting twist for your site if you managed to find companies that are telling the truth about their offering. Again, are there any out there that are up to a decent standard of honesty and ethics that the public should know about?

Look forward to your response. Good luck to you.

I respect your site and how you have expessed you opinions in an objective nature and would like to let you know that Rich and Kale and about 21 of the other top producer's in Equinox did leave because of the politics of Bill Guildd and his unstoppable urge to chase women. I would like for you to check out Rich and Kale's new venture called Trek Alliance at trekalliance.com and give me your opinion on that I have to go for now and wish you and your family a great new year.

Just wanted to let you know that I finished reading Ruth Carter's new book on the AMO's yesterday (actually, I received it yesterday and couldn't put it down - a real page turner). I ordered it from Amazon.com and had it in two days.

Anyway. It was an excellent read. While I knew some of what was there from extensive research on Amway and Quixtar, there was a lot of material I had not seen and that was very interesting. Keep up the good work on revealing the truth behind these organizations.

This should be a "must read" by anyone getting into Amway or Quixtar. And, I would guess, Amway must be VERY unhappy with this book :)

Keep up the good fight!

Although I didn't expect to receive a letter in response to my letter to you I am happily surprised. It's nice to know that your are taking that time out of your life to give people like me more details.

I am however surprised that your opinion of Equinox is as bad as it is when you never did it. I myself have never even heard of companies like Amway until these last few months. You see, a good friend of mine has an aunt that became very wealthy in Amway. Because of this I find it hard to believe that so many have failed to find their success. What was done differently?

I did read the reports on Equinox International and their AMS seminars that you referred to me and found it quite comical! Those people are getting wealthy on Health Products! Who would have guessed. I've heard of it happening with life insurance but never something that might benifit our society! To me this is very ironic.

Again I truly appreciate your response letter and sights for further information.

Sincerly,

I just ran across your sight, and wanted to share my story.

My husband and I joined in February of 89, and were active, core distributors for 8 years. Amvox, Standing Order, most of the current catalogs, we all ate it up. We never got above the 2500 pv level, but we drove on, mostly due to friendship of our upline. I sincerely believe they wanted our success, but we couldn't figure out why people didn't see what we saw. We really made good friends, and actually got a lot of help building the business - but we never could hit that direct level.

We spent a lot of time away from our daughter, and our family didn't understand why we were doing this. Looking back, I have to wonder that myself. " You are who you associated with " is a statement I heard a lot. And on the surface, I wanted to hang with the successful people, to learn what they learned, so I could be like them. But as I spent more time with my direct and diamond, I saw too much negative. Diamonds probably worked as hard as the new person trying to juggle jobs and a side busines. They had junk to deal with. Their hours were just as long, and I realized it wouldn't be easy being a diamond.

They say the price you pay to go diamond is so worth it. I'm not too sure about that. It's too emotional, when you have to deal with people all the time. You can't depend on them.

I will say I do like the products, though. the corporation itself I cannot say anything negative about it. It's just the system to work it has so many pitfalls. Maybe with the advent of the internet, things may be different for distributors. For us, we'll keep our membership, so we can keep buying some of our favorite products - but we're staying out of that political business building process!

I don't know if you are familiar with this site but it has a lot of detailed info on the Make Money Fast (MMF) scams that plague the internet. You may wish to add its URL to your list. It doesn't go after MLM specifically, but it does give a lot of inside info on what you can expect. - Funny thing, you told me about Melaleuca and the class action lawsuit they were involved in. Yet your site was given to me by a man IN Melaleuca to convince me I should join! I told him no thanks! - Regards,

Yes I also lost thousands in Equinox. The unwillinness to let you know what was going on in the beginning was devistating at the end ....All I want to know is how do I joinn thiscrusade to recopsome of if not all my money I put in that business to the tune of 25000 dollars .....

Sincerly

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