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The following posts have been reprinted in their entirety from posts e-mailed by readers of this website, except that headers, names and locations have been removed. These posts express the opinions and experiences of their authors, and this site publisher makes no representations about them in any way whatsoever.

Re: Amway

Re: Nikken

Hi:

Thanks in advance!

Part II

Hi Ruth:

Hmm, curious. I know Nikken, according to their policies and procedures, buys back product when it is in "resaleable condition". A few friends of mine have had good, fair experiences with this. Perhaps the complaints were made by people who tried selling back to the company "un-resaleable" products?

best,

Part III

Ruth:

Thanks for the info! Another question: are you presently involved in a network marketing company? Or, having the experiences you've had, are you turned off from it forever? Just curious. I realize I am biased (no doubt you've guessed that I am a Nikken distributor), but my experiences with Nikken have all been positive.

I think it is a powerful, well-poised company that is genuinely concerned about global wellness (and making money -- it is a business, of course). Amway's sales, as most of us know, have plummeted greatly here in the US. Many wonder if that is the reason for Amway's charges that Nikken is unlawfully using "their" patented magnetic design. Providing justice is served, we'll all see in the end who is telling the truth.

wishing you well ...

best,

Re: Quixtar

I was recently contacted by my "cousin-in-law" (with whom I rarely have communication) about an exciting business opportunity that he thought I might be interested in. Before he even said another word I was on to the fact that this was an "Amway" approach to getting unsuspecting people to want more information. I mean really, my "cousin-in-law"? I see him once a year at Thanksgiving and am I really stupid enough to believe that he would care what I thought about a new business unless there was something in it for him? That's what brought me to your web-site. I have found your research to be very interesting.

For years, I have been approached by friends, co-workers, colleagues, family, and mere aquaintenances about a "fantastic business opportunity" that they would like to share with me and twice I attended meetings. The first one was my introduction to Amway and even then I thought it sounded like a scam. The second one made me furious to find out after I had rearranged my schedule and driven about 30 miles that it was really Amway. Needless to say, in that meeting there were no new distributors signed up. I highly resent a company that wants to remain anonymous until you have heard a 30 minute presentation on how this can make you money and then the first thing they want you to do is exploit your friends and family to do the same.

I have really enjoyed your web pages and the reason I am sending you a letter is to ask about what you have found out about the company recently. I notice that on the information I can pull up that the latest entry is from Dec., 1999. I hope your are not going to tell me that you have been restrained from this type of communication by some threst of a lawsuit. Its about time someone published the truth about MLM's. I think what has been the secret to Amway's success over the years is that everyone deep down inside has dreams of becoming rich and if they aren't getting there with their jobs and they weren't born rich they are looking for a quick fix. I believe that the only way to gain financial independence is through hard work and dilligence.

Please let me know if you have published more recent information on Quixtar and where I can find it.

Thank you

Re: Quixtar

I was looking over the information in your web site regarding Quixtar. Could you tell me why nothing has been posted since last September?

Thanks

Re: Omegatrend

Dear Sir / Madam

Although I think your site is an excellent way of informing people of their choices, in some cases the MLM companies in question could be very good and this site may scare people off.

There are over 15,000 different MLM companies in the world, so of course there will be "the good, the bad and the ugly". I don't believe you can place every MLM company in the same category.

However I believe that if you do want to join a MLM company - don't just join the first one that comes along. Take responsibility for you own choices and actions. Your decision should ultimately be based on your own personal research, not from other peoples experiences.

I read David Gerard's experience with great interest. The reason for this is because I am in Omegatrend. Before I became a member I did a lot of research in to it (and other MLM companies) and in my option Omegatrend is the most ethical and well run company I found.

I joined in 1999 so it would be quite a few years after David would have been in it and to be honest I can not relate David's experience to my own. I personally believe 100% in the products and company. I also happen to have two of the most fantastic up line coaches, so maybe that makes a huge difference between a good and bad experience with any MLM?

There seems to be a lot of confusion between Pyramid Selling (which is highly illegal) and ethical MLM business. Whilst your job is to warn people, I also believe you should make people aware of all the differences.

I have seen another MLM site recently and they gave a list of things you should be aware of when joining an MLM. For example, you should be highly suspicious if the company asks you to pay a large joining fee - I would consider $800 or more a large fee. Do you have to buy in bulk and then re-sell? Again this does not sit well with me.

When deciding what MLM to join I extensively used this list and Omegatrend came out tops every time, I simply buy what I need and do not sell anything, which I am very happy about.

Keep up the good work with informing people but please do not scare them off potentially good MLM companies.

Thank you for hearing me out.

Regards -

Re: Equinox

Dear Survivor,

My friend ** invited me to a meeting to introduce me to a wonderful opportunity to become independently wealthy. She said all she had to do was put up $5,000.00 and they would do the rest for her.

I made an appointment to meet with the woman who had signed ** to Equinox. She wanted me to take out a loan or put $5,000.00 worth of products on a credit card. I ask her if she thought I was crazy or stupid. I told her I liked the products and would continue to purchase products from Equinox. However I had no interest in complicating my busy life with the anxiety of added dept. and the effort to become a salesperson.

** was very unhappy with me for not getting into the business and attending a seminar with her. It seemed that her mentor with Equinox was blaming her for failing to sign up sheep (your term) and she was feeling desperate. This created a lot of tension between us.

My friend ** used her credit card to get into the business, she found that she was unable to sell the products or recruit others to sign with Equinox. She said the concept of using other peoples money to get started made good sense. I pointed out that credit card companies were only to happy to have her use their money since she would be paying for the privilege long after the initial money had been paid back to them.

After reading your story, I am grateful that I had the good sense to recognize that the opportunity was only a way for someone else to take my money. Thank you for sharing your story.

Re: MLM

i think that MLMs are FAR better than

Re: Melaleuca

Hello. I wrote you the other day and thanked you for the info on the lawsuit. I also wrote to my upline and asked them to review the information. I found out that THEY were actually witnesses in the trial. Please, if it is all with him, I would appreciate you contacting him and getting the other side of the story. There was more than just people trying to make Melaleuca work as a business going on in the issue.

You work very hard to present an honest site, and that means looking at all the evidence you can find and weighing it carefully. You have done an excellent job with AmWay, now please use the same due care with Melaleuca. If you choose not to hear an eye witness account to what happened - from the defense position - then I must assume you are ruled by bias and your site is no longer a valid source of information.

I hope you consider this with the integrity I know you have.

Part II

Hi, Ruth. Thanks for getting back to me. I had been waiting for my friend to let me know it was ok with him to have him contact you. But since I got your email first, I just sent ** your email and asked him to write to you. He and his wife were contacted as witnesses in that lawsuit. I'll not say anymore at this time, as it is ** story to tell, not mine. Thank you for being willing to listen. Let me know what you think.

God Bless,

Re: Quixtar

Hello,

I was recently approached by a friend and introduced to "Quixtar", luckily I found your website, while I was researching the company. I have three questons for you. First, when do you plan to do your next update on the site? Next, what exactly does Microsoft and IBM have to do with Quixtar? Finally, my friend may be seriously buying into the MLM scam, I do not want to burst his bubble, because he seems pretty happy, but what would you suggest I do to warn him, or tell him this is nothing more than "Amway on the internet". Thanks or taking time to read and respond to my e-mail, Great Site!

"All Limitations are self-Imposed"

Re: Quixtar

Dear Madam,

I was approached by a Quixtar representative (an IBO, I guess they're called) and invited to a seminar where I was to find out more about this exciting new enterprise that I was under the impression the individual I had met initiated and was collobarating with IBM. How sorely I was disappointed when I arrived at the scene and found a group of a mostly lower class workers listening to the preachings of a so-called Quixtar success story (a man who barely knew English and had yet, though Quixtar, made himself a fortune). Here is a copy of the e-mail I sent to this person shortly after attending this seminar, detailing why I didn't wish to be a part of Quixtar.

---

Dear XXX,

Having gone over the 6-4-2 Marketing Plan and the entire Quixtar package, I have reached the conclusion that I simply do not wish to participate in this hierarchical "profit-sharing" venture. Let me outline below several reasons why I feel that Quixtar is not for me:

1. Quixtar involves a time commitment (at least five hours a week, and more when you're just starting out) -- this is a time commitment that I neither afford nor desire. Despite the fact that one may say you can always squeeze out an extra five hours and that we waste so much time doing idle pointless things, I would much rather divert any free time to, say, my health and general well-being (in the form of exercise) than to the pursuit of monetary wealth.

2. Most people who are tempted to join Quixtar (as evidenced by the seminar I attended) are people, perhaps without a strong educational background and occupying a low grade job, enticed by the prospect of riches. I expect to follow an academic path in my life, and as such, the satisfaction that money may bring me cannot compare to any intellectual satisfaction I may achieve. Of course, there are examples to the contary, like the Ph.D. in Biostatistics and the double-B.A.Sc., but judging from the crowd who attended the seminar, this seems to be an accurate trend. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that money means nothing to me. I recognise that I would like to live a comfortable life, but there are certain things that I will not compromise. One of those things is my academics and that being the case, Quixtar is simply inappropriate at this point in my life.

3. The process by which one goes about succeeding in Quixtar involves something that I find morally reprehensible, namely befriending those one encounters with the sole intention of using them for one's own monetary betterment. This is contrary to the ideals of true friendship, and it is what I find most distressing about the Quixtar program. Despite any financial success I may achieve after years of courting people for Quixtar, I am not willing to compromise my ethics for monetary gain. ( Note: I do not judge those who find Quixtar a perfectly acceptable means of making a living, as their situation differs from mine entirely, and I may chose similarly if I were in their shoes )

4. I was also upset/annoyed by the fact that the marketing plan is misleading. In Step 1, the monthly "income" of $66.00 is bogus. While it is true that a penny saved is a penny earned, as a student I don't spend anywhere near $200 a month. My food is provided by my parents, my textbooks are bought and paid for, as is my residence. I simply attend classes, study, play sports, and occasionally go out with friends. Thus, the entire scheme on which Quixtar rests for my success is doomed to fail as long as I'm a student.

So, in conclusion, I wish you the best of luck in your Quixtar venture, XXX, but I am afraid that neither am I right for Quixtar, nor is Quixtar right for me.

---

That's my story.

Regards,

PS. Here's a site you might wish to "expose" in the future (related to Quixtar). www.ebizwave.com (the password is "quixtar") PSS. I really think your site is fantastic and I'm so glad that I found it!

Re: Amway and Quixstar

Dear MLM survivors,

Thanks to your website, my brother and I were able to uncover the true nature of the Amway/Quixtar Corporation's complex pyramid scheme (scam) before I got involved in Quixtar. Unfortunately, our father was duped and we were unable to talk some sense into him (even by showing him your website and by proving that Microsoft's and Bill Gates' involvement with Quixtar was simply a business/customer relation and not a partnership as Quixtar representatives claim). Our father's stubborn, arrogant, and condescending attitude towards us in every aspect is so overwhelming that we decided to give up on him and let him learn the hard way.

I just wanted to share my experience with Amway and now Quixtar with you. A number of years ago, I was involved with Amway for several months until I realized that it was a joke. I just had a gut feeling that this business was not viable. Anyway, I didn't feel comfortable with the concept of operating my so-called "own business" while being brainwashed and manipulated like a puppet by a bunch of superficial, materialistic bourgeois wannabes who were led to believe that they could duplicate other people's successful lives. (Quite a soap opera!)

I was even told that if I worked hard within the Amway system (now called Quixtar since they got a new website in September 1999), in 2-3 years, I would be financially independent (meaning: I'd be making $ 200 000 to $ 300 000 a year). What kind of a dupe would believe in such a fantasy? How many people would I have to screw over to get there? But they say, if successful people like the DeVos and Van Andel families (the owners of Amway/Quixtar Corporation) can make it; so can the rest of us mortals. Besides, they will provide us with the tools (tapes, books, Amvox, conventions/Rallies) we need to succeed in building and duplicating this "dream business".

Of course, the only feasible way to succeed in this business is through sponsorship: Getting people interested in this obscure monkey business and sponsoring (duping) them. That way you can make points whenever they (your pupils) purchase goods from the network or sponsor other people (fish). This becomes the ultimate key to success and growth in this business and translates into fast cash with the least amount of effort. What an astute plan! Would'nt you say? Thus, this is the way I picture this elaborate pyramid scam. The selling and purchasing of goods are only the superficial pretext of this complex scam. The only way to go is to sucker people into it and milk them for everything they have or don't have (time and money).

First of all, how can anyone do business with family and friends in such a shallow way? Every acquaintance, friend and family member becomes a potential prospect at any given time. By soliciting them, you change the basis of your existing relationship (love, trust, respect, etc.). To look at one's own son, sister or friend as a means to acquire personal financial gain is in itself distorted. This change in mindset created by trying to acquire business partners on an ongoing basis, threatens the essence of sound and meaningful human relations. Not only is this self-seeking approach detrimental and destructive to friendship and family ties but forms the basis of the breakdown and corruption of society through the promotion of selfish, materialistic and consumerist values.

Secondly, how can anyone be expected to believe blindly in the prophecies of the founders of the Amway Corporation and now in "the Quixtar Revolution". They claim that any form of employment equals exploitation and any type of traditional business is risky, harsh and likely to fail. They'll have you believe through their tapes and books that they offer the only viable and self-sustainable economic alternative. The reality is however, that in this type of pyramid scheme, only the prophets make the profit... In one of the propaganda/motivational tapes to which I was listening, a redneck from Alabama, who was talking like he had never read a book in his life, was teaching people how to contact and relate to others "with posture" (meaning: that they are doing them a favour by spending some of their valuable time with them; WHAT A CROCK!) I'm a highly educated man who has friends from all walks of life and their time is as valuable to them as it is to me; that's why we make the most of the time we choose to spend together. This arrogant S.O.B. on the tape was training people (who obviously didn't think highly of themselves) to put themselves on a pedestal and assess whether another person is at their level of ambition or higher up in the food chain, so they can manipulate them accordingly. For example, a poor person should be dreaming of owning a new refrigerator, not a Mercedes and a wealthy professional should be dreaming of owning an estate, not a new car. What a promising social movement!

Thirdly, this so-called socio-economic program that will benefit humanity and the global economy once we all join and spread the "good news" is nothing more than a crass form of egotistical materialism and mass consumerism advocated by T.V. evangelists and religious fanatics from the southern U.S who claim to promote a Christian business and spiritual movement. This so-called spiritual movement guided by the narrowing of attention on making money results in a cult-like movement. After they brainwash you, they take you to the cleaners; the only problem is that you might end up losing your shirt in the process!

Fourthly, what does Christianity have to do with money anyway? Christ condemned the profaners of the temple of Jerusalem for using a place of worship to conduct business. The thought of anyone conducting business in church on a Sunday makes me sick. Christ said to the people who were trying to corrupt him with Roman coins: "Return to Caesar what belongs to Caesar, and to God what belongs to God". As far as I'm concerned, anyone who utilizes religion as a means of acquiring economic or political power is a bigot and a profaner, not a Christian. Christ said that it was easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. A Christian is a person who loves Christ, not money. As a conclusion, I would like to say that people should have dreams and seek to fulfill them. (If you build it, it will come...) Dreams are free and can not be sold or purchased. However, chasing after someone else's dream is like chasing the wind; it's empty. Believe in yourself and your dreams may come true but beware of those who are trying to sell you a dream; it can prove to be quite an expensive and deceptive lesson.

Thank you for your attention.

Re: Amway

Dear Ruth,

I am VERY thankful for your quick response and I am sure your experiences with Amway will help people here on the other side of this small planet :) I will visit your website and I am sure that there will be materials that would be good to read in Hungarian :) I'll write again.

God bless you!

Re: Amway

I MUST SAY THAT THIS IS THE MOST PATHETIC EXCUSE FOR QUITTING. YOU QUIT, THE BUSINESS DIDN'T FAIL. I AM NOT A DISTRIBUTOR BUT I HAVE SEEN WHAT IT HAS DONE FOR MY FAMILY AND FRIENDS. I ALSO ATTEND THE FUNCTIONS BECAUSE I ENJOY THE UPLIFTING INFORMATION THAT THEY PROMOTE AND HELP YOU GET ON WITH LIFE IN A WORLD THAT IS SO CORRUPT WITH DISHONEST PEOPLE IN IT. YOU NEED TO TAKE A GOOD HARD LOOK AT WHAT THE POINT IS WHEN YOU PUT DISHONEST THINGS ON THE INTERNET. I AM PURELY DISCUSTED. YOU AND I BOTH KNOW THAT THE DIAMOND DIDN'T MAKE NO MONEY. NOT ONLY THAT AMWAY HAS SEVERAL DIFFERENT LEGS. YOU MAY HAVE BEEN IN ONE THAT DOES THINGS A DIFFERENT WAY THAN THE OTHERS AND MAYBE YOU SHOULD STATE THAT. DON'T BLAME AMWAY FOR YOUR FAILURE AND FIGHTING IN YOUR MARRIAGE. I FEEL SORRY FOR YOU. HAVE A GREAT LIFE. BUT KEEP THE DISHONESTY OUT OF THE MINDS OF OTHERS.

Re: Microsoft and Quixtar

Thought this was an intersting esponse, but it probably comes at no suprise to you.......

--------

Thank you for your mail about Microsoft's involvement in the Quixtar project. Microsoft Corp., specifically Microsoft Consulting Services, is a consultant to the Amway development staff for this project. As it does for many businesses, Microsoft is supporting its customer, Fry Technology. Fry has been hired by Amway to complete this e-commerce project for Quixar using Microsoft products and technologies. Microsoft's role is as a technology provider, and with our line of products and services is providing the technical platform, development tools, consulting, and direct product support to Amway and to Fry for certain components of the project.

Sincerely,

Jo-Anne

microsoft.com Customer Support

--- Original Message ---

From: ***

To: msft_css@css.one.microsoft.com

Sent: 3/14/2000 2:50:14 PM

Subject: Business Partner question

I was told by a local business person that Microsoft is in partnership with a website called quixtar.com. I cannot find anything related to this web site on the MS site, could clarify how or if MS is associated with quixtar.com? Thanks in advance for your response

Re: MLM

Thanks Ruth. I appreciate your responce! Maybe I can fix the exicution part of one someday if my next diet & fitness book takes off. I'd sure like to see people be supported in being able to afford a healthy & happy life.

Best,

Re: Amway

Hi,

My name is **, I am 18 years old from New Zealand, and I have just finished High School. I am anxiously needing a good job, because I live in a flat with all the expenses which come with it.

I have been shown the plan, and promised and shown of all the successes that come with it. I guess I am naive, and unsure as to whether or not I should become registered. I have already held meetings at my place and attended numerous seminars and meetings. I guess I am desperately in need of advice. I have listened to the 'Tape of the week' and read books about MLM, and come away from them feeling hopeful and very excited. Most of all the people I talk to about this business, tell me to be careful and say it is an illegal pyriamid scheme. Also, Amway has such a bad reputation in New Zealand.

But why?

And why have I been shown of so many success stories? Are these all fiction?

I will purchase your book now and read in to it a bit more. But as I said, please can you give me advice as to what to do? I'm 18, have I been sucked in? In a way, it is rather disappointing to read what is in your book, after I have been introduced to my dreams and aspirations.

However, I am sorry as to what happened to you.

Yours sincerely,

Re: Amway

Dear Ruth:

My wife who is a struggling dentist recently signed us up for this crazy scheme. She is of course very frustrated with HMO's and the pernicious ways that the health care system is affecting young medical professionals like herself. She was a perfect target for these sharlatans.

Is there anyone I can talk to or communicate with to try and get the right information that will free me from this materialistic prison? I have never seen a more zealous group of individuals deny what is right in front of their faces. Please email me with some advice or a contact or something.

D. McMenamin

Re: Skybiz 2000

Thanks for your reply. I understand you are very busy and I don't wish to make the load any heavier, but I must comment on your e-mail. The RCMP has NOT taken action against Skybiz, in fact our President has begged them to do it so we may have our day in court. They refused to either charge us or withdraw the statement made by one of their members.

One member of the RCMP out of Regina, Saskatchewan declared that Skybiz is anillegal pyramid and went to the lengthof saying this to Global Televisionwho aired a 3-minute, very biased,clip on their newscast to this end.Theresult was a near-declaration of warup here and the RCMP as well as the TV network were swamped with calls about it. The network even admitted that the call-in responses were almost all positive, only one was negative, supporting Skybiz.

I'm not sure of what follows, but the RCMP have declared that they are neither laying charges, nor investigating the situation because they have no complaints. The BBB have no complaints, and the Federal Government's Trade & Commerce, Fair Trades deparatment etc. have no complaints, so the whole thing is really attributed to the usual media blow-up. I am reasonably certain that Skybiz has launched a suit against the RCMP, Global Television and the constable responsible for starting this whole thing. Stay tuned.

Best regards

[Since this email was sent, the RCMP has arrested at least four Canadian Skybiz distributors.]

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